Speaking as an American here… could we NOT park cars in the left lane. I’ve seen enough habits of drivers in other countries where the left lane is exclusively for passing, it’s so simple and superior for traffic but Americans be dumb selfish shits behind the wheel.
Where i live it’s fucking madness. People change lanes randomly, sit in the far left going 10 under the limit, pass on the right or left at seeming random, and sometimes just drive in the middle lane doing 30 mph in a 70 mph zone with their fucking hazards on. Don’t even get me started on their merge technique, jealousy and resentment are what rule people’s decisions and nobody has ever even heard of zipper merging. It’s a shock there aren’t more accidents than there are.
I once watched someone sitting in the far left at the limit, come up against someone driving on the left going 10 under, decide to undertake, and then slow down to like 30 under to “punish” the person.
I’ve changed lanes to pass only to have people change in front of me to block me, then change back when i changed back.
But most of all, and it should be noted i drive a two seater sports car here, i’ve had people in their huge ass SUVs look over at me, MAKE EYE CONTACT with me, and then merge into whatever lane i was in at the time like they were trying to drive me off the road.
Fuck!
PARKING in the left lane? The hell? Isnt parking in any lane forbidden? Especially on a highway?
It’s a phrase some people use. Specifically prevalent in California. “Parking their Ass in the left lane” Means somebody driving in the left lane at 10mph below the speed limit.
Speed limits dont work, road design determines how fast people go.
A section of the A24 was limited to 130 kmph for 20 years to reduce accidents. Because the reduction the speed limit was lifted early this year. Now there are 8% more accidents with injury and 42% more injured. Politicians call now to make it possible to limit the section again.
For highway lowering the speed may be effective but lowering the speed limit from 50 to 30 won’t stop drivers from going 50 unless the road is designed for lower speeds. So long as lanes are wide and there are little obstructions for drivers to worry about hitting, such as bumpouts, boulevards, etc., they will go as fast as they feel comfortable unless there is a cop behind them.
Edit: 50kmh to 30kmh I don’t know what that is in freedom miles
BTW: the mortality is around 50% if a car hits a pedestrian at 50km/h.
At 30km/h it’s around 3%.
So yeah, speed in centre ville counts!
Or just do like we do in the US and place an “undercover” cop every quarter mile behind street signs.
it looks like it’s designed for pretty extreme speeds
Unlike the average driver.
It’s not actually. It’s quite an old network so it was built before cars could go as fast as they can go now. There are surprisingly sharp corners and very short off ramps. If it were built from scratch today it would be even safer. Speed limits are bs outside of particularly tricky areas.
Is the image from the article not of the highway in question?
Ah yep my bad, I was speaking generally. The image in the article is only a short section of highway but it does look like one of the 2 lane sections that are usually quite old. If they were more modern and built for higher speeds they’d have an even shallower curve and would probably be 3 lanes with a hard shoulder. If you drive on the Autobahn you’ll have a few moments where you notice the difference in road layout from those which more modern highways implement - the on and off ramps in particular can be a bit scary.
Speed limits absolutely do work if there are cameras and consequences. Unfortunately everyone seems to have decided that suspending licences and siezing cars is a human rights violation.
Speed limits do work, but the road should be designed with the speed limit in mind. Just slapping a new sign up and reducing the speed limit is going to lead to non-compliance - even if the speed limit is enforced by police.
The UK recently released figures on speed limit compliance. For 20mph roads (30-35kph) they primarily measured roads that didn’t have traffic calming measures recommended for 20mph roads (ie the roads don’t “feel” like 20mph roads), and they found 85% of drivers exceeded the speed limit.
High gasoline prices also influence the average speed on the highways. The vast majority of people do not usually go faster than 120, many even less.
Idk, I’m seeing plenty of people here for whom gasoline is evidently not expensive enough yet
That is the problem, people with high end cars have enough money to pay an expensive fuel. Apart with an industry which mostly expensive high end E-cars, the high fuel prices only affect the people wich don’t have money for such cars.
Well the funny part is that it’s not even people in high-end cars that I’m seeing
I was referring to those who go 300 on the highway, difficult for those with an old Ford Fiesta.
The Autobahn has become very tiring to drive on. Most people somehow decided that its easiest to drive in the middle lane at slow(ish) speeds, while the right lane stays empty for long stretches. Since you are not allowed to overtake on the right lane, both the left lane and the middle lane are clogged most of the time, averaging about 100-120 Km/h. If the public transportation was a bit more reliable and cheaper I would sell my car.
Most people somehow decided that its easiest to drive in the middle lane at slow(ish) speeds, while the right lane stays empty for long stretches.
Really? In my experience driving on German roads (primarily down near Munich), lane discipline is exceptionally good. The only times I saw significantly lower driving standards was in rush hour.
Meanwhile, the UK is notorious for people sitting in the middle lane. That used to be the rule, the inside lane was the slow lane, middle for cruising and outside for overtaking, however that was changed in the 60s/70s. It’s recently been made formally illegal, rather than just contrary to the highway code, but even trained police drivers are still guilty of doing it.
In the Netherlands they’re very big on pulling back in. So much so they frequently cut your nose off by pulling in so early.
It’s fun seeing how driving styles vary between different regions and countries.
Yeah, that might be the case. I recently drove to Berchtesgaden and it was better in the south. I live near the Danish border. Haha, people here are a bit laid back.
I dont experience that in the part of Germany where I live but either way, have you seen how they drive in other countries? Thats wild compared to Germany…
The problem is that even in low traffic, there is a truck on the right lane every few meters. Often, after you switch to the right lane, someone decides to drive right next to you, forcing you to brake.
It’s just more comfortable to stay in the middle lane.Now IMHO the real problem is when trucks are overtaking with 101km/h…
10 seconds. If you’re not overtaking anything within 10 seconds, you should pull into the inside lane.
This is what I was taught in advanced driver training. However, in practice I use 7 seconds, because I find 10 seconds a little too far to easily estimate by eye. I end up thinking “is that 10 seconds? I’m not sure, maybe” then by the time I figure out it was more than 10 seconds it is now less than 7.
trucks are overtaking with 101km/h
As trucks are governed to a Vmax of 90 kph, and some even to 85 kph, I would suggest you get your speedometer checked, because it sounds like the advancement, required by law, is too high. It shouldn’t show more than 7% more than your actual speed. Truck speedos are more rigorously controlled and show an average of 2 kph too much at 80 kph, so trucks overtaking at 101 kph is not normally possible - of course, speedo manipulation does occur, but it isn’t so rampant that they all overtake at 101 kph.
Okay, I never looked at a truck’s speedometer. The point is they are overtaking just slightly faster.
It certainly feels like most trucks are going at least 90 km/h regularly.
The point is they are overtaking just slightly faster.
Trucks also spent long stretches in the same order, sometimes they change things up.
The speeds of trucks are measured on-board by a tachograph, so any big deviation can give them a fine, even if they weren’t caught on the spot.
And that 20 second delay really isn’t gonna impact the trip as a whole. Just rolling with it will make your trip less stressful, and therefore more enjoyable. If you’re late, rushing through traffic isn’t gonna make a significant impact, except on your risk of accidents.
And that 20 second delay really isn’t gonna impact the trip as a whole.
That is true. Therefore there shouldn’t be a problem with drivers driving a steady speed in the middle lane.
Truck driver have timelines. It is totally okay, if they need to occupy the middle lane. Sometimes even the left lane. It is more rare then middle lane sitters.
But what is not okay is that the cultural habit of “don’t clog” has forgotten. People are ignorant shits these days when entering cars.
If you decide to travel via 100 kph and do not want to flow with the traffic, then just stick to the right lane and flow with the trucks?! This way you have the most fuel savings as well.
It is totally okay, if they need to occupy the middle lane.
Truck drivers are running a commercial operation, I shouldn’t have to be inconvenienced so they can more easily make money - especially not when that inconvenience is caused by them not following the rules of the road.
Sometimes even the left lane.
This may be illegal, depending on jurisdiction and circumstances.
Truck drivers are running a commercial operation, I shouldn’t have to be inconvenienced so they can more easily make money - especially not when that inconvenience is caused by them not following the rules of the road.
It is about the person sitting inside the ferry. Once you work together with drivers you will change your attitude torwards them immediately. They working conditions are very difficult. Especially when they are crossing jurisdications/states.
When I am driving I have no problems eith truck drivers. They even help going onto the highway or mention radars.
The people sitting in the middle are the problem. Most of them doesn’t even accelerate passing another middle-lane-sitter.
Im driving for two decades. I did multiple years of disposition. I’m telling you: Middle sitters are the problem and responsible for most crashes on the autobahn.
It is about the person sitting inside the ferry. Once you work together with drivers you will change your attitude torwards them immediately. They working conditions are very difficult. Especially when they are crossing jurisdications/states.
This is the classic “feel sorry for the waiter working on sub-minimum wage, he’s supposed to be subsidised by tips!” bullshit argument. Yes, truck drivers are a victim of the businesses they work for and aren’t paid well enough. That doesn’t mean that they, as representatives of the business they work for, should get away with doing things that are wrong and inconvenience everyone else. Particularly when it is the business that sets the conditions that push drivers to behave as they do.
The truck driver might not be making much of a profit, for the long hours they work. But the truck is there to make a profit. The majority of everyone else on the road is not driving for work. People driving for work should not inhibit everyone else, who are inherently paying a loss to drive somewhere.
In fact, drivers in general shouldn’t inhibit others. Driving in the outside lane when you’re not overtaking is a shitty move, regardless.
Pay attention, plan well ahead to pull out when you need, accelerate as needed so you don’t hold up anyone when you pull out.
If you’re not willing or able to accelerate, then you shouldn’t pull out. By all means indicate your intention (and do so well in advance), but don’t move over until the lane is clear.
When I am driving I have no problems eith truck drivers. They even help going onto the highway or mention radars.
The people sitting in the middle are the problem.
Yeah, but we’re talking about truck drivers who sit in the middle lane.
It sounds like you’re from somewhere where this isn’t much of a problem. The professional drivers are professional. That’s awesome, but know that it doesn’t hold true everywhere, either across the US or in Europe or elsewhere. It’s not even a national thing, driving habits vary by region.
But yeah, people sitting in the middle is a problem. The bigger problem is that it’s so poorly defined - I was taught “if you’re not overtaking within 10 seconds, you should pull over”. 10 seconds is very conservative, I work to 7 seconds.
Driving on occassion on the A8 near Stuttgart and can’t confirm it.
Usually trucks are clogging the most right line and overtaking each on the 2nd lane.
Most PKWs drive on the 2nd/3rd lane while the racers and overtakers use the 3rd/4th lane.
Also who cares about overtaking from the right. If you drive 120kph and my lane all drive 130 kph I will naturally overtake you. No need to switch lanes if the lane is free. Just don’t overtake at +30 kph but more at 10 kph in relation to base Autobahn speed.Just don’t overtake at +30 kph but more at 10 kph
The law does account for this: If all lanes are well populated and you find your lane is actually moving faster than the lane to your left, you may pass - not overtake - on the right, as long as you are not more than 20 kph faster than the left lane.
The difference is in passing and overtaking: Passing is merely going faster than the other lane, but staying in your lane afterwards. Overtaking, or to give it its correct name of undertaking, is passing and then changing into the same lane as the passed vehicle.
Yeah, that’s what I meant.
Thanks for clarifying!
Yeah trucks across Europe are generally pretty good, primarily because in many countries it’s illegal for them to be in the 3rd lane (except sometimes in heavy slow moving traffic).
Overtaking from the right, or undertaking, is often illegal also, though. So while I agree that it should be ok, strictly speaking it isn’t.
What is legal is to overtake on the outside, move into their lane, then the inside lane, then slow down so they overtake you. Rinse and repeat, count how many donuts you can draw around them before they move over.
Don’t go faster than the speed of light (optional).
Fun fact: Germany is about average when it comes to road safety in Europe, which is still impressing since we’ve got the highest traffic density.
Vietnamese: Traffic Safety? What’s that?
Could be worse though
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate
We don’t have enough signs to make a speed limit happen - Volker Wissing, German minster of transit (Sadly not a joke: source)
Then, uh, get more?
Or just say: limit is 130 km/h and remove every sign saying 130 and higher. But that would all be too easy.
Was gonna say, before the Dutch did that stunt with time dependent speed limits the ‘unlimited’ sign just meant 130kph. At the border would be a sign explaining this and that’s that.
The FDP target group are above average people that enjoy fast expensive cars and that’s exactly what there politics are about. They are pretty much the only party pushing Porsches e-fuels in whole europe and keeping all incentives for the car lobby up and running.
That’s the dumbest excuse I’ve ever heard.
Hey, we have strikt rules on a highway! For example if you’re driving slower than everybody else and your IQ is under 70 you are prohibited to drive on the right lane even if it’s empty.
tallinn, estonia: yellow stop what’s that
Meanwhile in the U.S. with ✌️ speed limits ✌️ everyone goes 10 over and the exceptions are 20-30mph over.
Yup, 10 over is my default unless I’m on a highway, which is then 15 to 20 over.
It’s funny, but those who actually go the speed limit are the ones that people get mad at for going too slow. Even though they’re technically the only ones obeying the law.
Biggest laugh I had in a long time I am crying omg
You’re welcome.
If we get high enough the sound barrier will be at highway speeds.
True, but if you’re high you shoukdn’t drive
Having no general speed limit needs to be a thing of the past. The speed difference between people who wanna drive economically and safely and those who want to put the pedal to the floor is just too big. It may have worked in the 50’s to the 80’s where fast cars were the exception, but nowadays virtuall every family sedan is capable of reaching 180 km/h or more. If you’re going a leisurely 100-120 and someone is doing a low level flight at at least double your speed, things get dangerous. Traffic density simply doesn’t allow that idiocy anymore.
Even if there is no speed limit, there is a guideline speed of 130 kmh and the right-hand driving rule. If the rules are adhered to, you only overtake in one of the left lanes (whereby you must first check whether the lane is free) and then back again. It is not a big problem if you are overtaken with a speed difference of 200 kmh. Of course, the speed must be selected according to the traffic situation, which means that you are only on the road at high speeds when the highway is clear.
With 180-200km/h delta you couldn’t possibly judge the traffic situation, let alone react in time. I think you meant 100km/h difference, right?
But even with a delta of “only” 100km/h the distance between cars shrinks by about 30m per seconds. Even with optimal visibility and full attention on the road this gives you a couple seconds at best to correctly assess the situation. Then you can only punch the brakes and hope you remain in controll over your vehicle.
Imho there is no justification to allow PKW move that fast. At those speeds you not only your life but that of others as well.
And i haven’t even touched on the environmental impact and fuel efficiency of high speeds.
I’ve learned that with a distance of 2 seconds you have always the right distance to the other car, independent with which speed. That is easier as to calculate the meters, enogh to look when the car in front passes some mark (post, tree, some sign…), count 21 …22. When you then pass this mark, you have a distance that allows you to stop safely.
It makes a difference if there is an unlimited section, I start to overtake someone with my weak base engine VW Golf and accelerate to 130 to complete my pass. And then a BMW/Audi/Mercedes approaches at 200+, flashing his high beams barely two car lengths behind me. I’m by no means an insecure driver, it just drives me mad. Some people think that just because an unlimited section of the Autobahn has started, everybody needs to move out of their way immediately or take part in a top speed chase with them. The sense of entitlement is strong out there.
If you want to drive slow, don’t do it in the left lane.
Problem solved
At which speed would I be allowed to use the left lane to overtake someone on the Autobahn, then? Somewhere north of 180? I’m assuming you have vast experience on the German highway system, so please do let me know.
When there is nobody driving that fast behind you in the left lane. I assume you look into your mirrors before switching lanes…? If so, whats the issue with people going faster occasionally on the left lane?
I want to know more about the top picture, anyone know the source?
Anything above the speed limit is illegal.
