I’m so confused by all these comments. Does nobody know what a primary is? That’s precisely the time to vote your conscience or register a protest vote; all the (valid) arguments about helping Trump only apply in the general election.
and even then WA is too blue for a green party protest vote to risk anything. vote for biden in nevada or arizona yeah but if anything it’s better to go third party in a deep blue state
Right, because things that happen now won’t have consequences later. Surely a primary result where “uncommitted” or other non-Biden choice gains traction wouldn’t be used by the GOP to trash the only viable Democrat running for president.
Do you think they won’t trash biden if we don’t protest?
Do you think they wouldn’t say he couldn’t win against trump?
If the GOP saying biden was unpopular is gonna change someone’s vote, they’ll say it whether its true or not, so that’s no excuse to vote against biden in the election that’s nothing but symbolic.
No, I think they become more dangerous when we play into their hands and give them scraps of incomplete data to reinforce their narrative.
I think this is an excuse to silence people who don’t support the Biden/Netanyahu genocide.
Imagine believing that the truth should be suppressed so that an incumbent can remain in power regardless of their actions and to avoid consequences.
Imagine that being the interpretation of words that didn’t say that thing. I think this attempt to push people toward an uncommitted vote is a tactic to split the left and generate infighting that can be exploited for the benefit of China, Russia, Iran and North Korea (and, to a lesser but still significant extent, the Republican party here in the USA). Manipulation of partial information to feed a narrative is not truth.
> I think this attempt to push people toward an uncommitted vote is a tactic to split the left and generate infighting that can be exploited for the benefit of China, Russia, Iran and North Korea (and, to a lesser but still significant extent, the Republican party here in the USA).
this is a conspiracy theory. the people advocating for it are explaining their motivation and tactic clearly. choosing not to believe them is paranoia.
That’s not really a conspiracy theory. It’s exactly how propaganda and state sponsored FUD works.
The spreaders of propaganda find a point where they can create dissension, create a talking point around that point of dissension, convince people that it’s their idea to buy into the dissension.
Example of how FUD works. This is not something that I know happened. This is just a hypothetical example of FUD works, it is not known fact. I was not sitting in a room with a bunch of Russian agents that decided to AstroTurf beehaw or some other radical left wing Lemmy instance with a trendy talking point so they can influence the 2024 American presidential election in an effort to get a president elected who will withdraw American support for NATO, eleminate funding for the Ukraine war effort, and support Zionist ambitions in Israel. This is just an example of how FUD works.
Russia/RNC/whoever see they can exploit the genocide in Israel to weaken Joe Biden by framing him as a perpetrator of genocide. They go on internet forums that are sympathetic to this cause like Lemmy. They pose as upset Democratic voters that are going to teach the DNC a lesson by refusing to vote for Joe Biden and help get Trump reelected. They have bad faith discussions with well meaning but gullible Lemmings (known as useful idiots or “UI”) and convince the UI that not supporting Joe Biden is the right thing to do and that the UI is a reasonable person that is just responding the facts in front of them. They do this by coming up with catchy nicknames like Genocide Joe and appealing to the UI’s need to feel heard and be represented. The UI then goes about their day spreading this message far and wide never realizing they were manipulated into believing something and engaging in an action that will ultimately harm them.
It’s standard procedure perfected by the Russians over the last 10 years or so. People are incredibly easy to manipulate, that’s why advertising and marketing are so effective.
Then I’m paranoid. Guess that’s what living through recent history does to observations of the present.
So your suggestion is to prevent infighting by enforcing silence? And this decidedly lack of discourse is for the benefit of Americans? Why is my disapproval of Biden, and want for the DNC to pick literally anyone else, better for foreign agents?
If someone was running against Biden in the primaries would you say the same thing?
Right? I used to think like the other sheep and vote for the do least harm candidate. Now I’m going to show the DNC that I can’t be bullied and vote Republican for everything, MAGA!
That will hold Joe Biden accountable and show the Democrats that there are consequences for their actions.
Republicans are not running in the Democratic primary.
So when should we protest?
EXACTLY! Republicans ONLY trash Democrats in Good Faith with Reality Based Arguments! If we DON’T give them Reality Based Arguments, they 100% WON’T trash us!
That makes no sense. The GOP will trash any Democratic candidate regardless, even if they have to make up shit to do so. If you want a candidate that will appeal to GOP voters, you’ll be best off with a Republican.
Genocide supporters broker no criticism.
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@dcpDarkMatter what part of this do you disagree with?
That’s what happens when you skip the primaries.
Did the same rhing to Obama.
I understand the motivation for this, but it’s a terrible plan when the other option is Trump. After this election, when Trump will prove too senile to run again, maybe we can revolt against our lackluster vanilla options.
Trump is not running in the Democratic primary.
No he’s not, and because the DNC isn’t doing exactly what I want I’m voting for Trump. We have have to show the DNC that if they aren’t running the candidates that are exactly in line with us we aren’t going to blindly fall in line.
And let’s face it, ours is the only voice that deserves to be heard. Moderade Democrats have run this country into the ground and we need to take it back by voting Republican up and down the ballot.
Not to get in the way of your masterfully constructed strawman argument, but it’s not possible to vote for Republicans in the Democrats’ primary.
I’m not talking about the primary, my apologies for conflating the two streams of thought.
Thread’s about the primary. And considering the massive strawman you constructed there, there’s no reason to believe that you weren’t muddying the waters on purpose.
That’s an interesting take. It seems like this thread is about sending a message to the DNC establishment, but maybe I missed the restriction of “sending a message to the DNC, but only through the Washington state primary”.
There is no strawman, only lived experience.
There is no strawman, only lived experience.
In my “lived experience,” people who belittle others’ objections to support for genocide do so because they support genocide.
I guess one man’s vanilla is another man’s mummy wraps.
And what options? When were we ever given a real choice?
You have the choice to start right now.
https://www.fec.gov/help-candidates-and-committees/registering-political-party/
You could start a Lemmings party if you so choose. It would likely only be able to be a state/local party at first though. That said… There could be several groups of us that create a Lemmings party in various states and eventually merge them into a national party.
It would be easier to just find someone willing to hold office and start campaigning / setting up and getting their name out there for 2028 but to be honest I do imagine the party creation thing may create a bigger pool of possibilities in the long run. (Aka funding and recognition).
Maybe the Lemmings party would strive to be like TST to bring science and responsibility to the forefront of a political party.
Obviously the Lemmings name was a joke, but it would be comical. Especially if it grew and members of the party didn’t even know what Lemmy was
I keep hearing next time next time next time.
It’s y’all’s turn to do next time
At 50 years old I’ve heard the ‘do it our way this time, and next time we can do it your way’ untold times. Our way never comes because the DNC always produces a Boogeyman that needs to be fought off and it’s urgent to pull together to defeat them, maybe next time.
I said the same thing. And got downvoted to hell by the indignant virtue signallers.
That might be because the point is completely and utterly stupid. We’re signalling the virtue of “understanding how primaries work”
Centrists, when people are upset that Democrats have found just enough no votes to block what they ran on: “No, you don’t understand how government works!”
Also centrists: “Voting uncommitted in a primary where Trump isn’t on the ballot is a vote for Trump!”
As well as the virtue of being a (somewhat) free country that doesn’t equate dissent with treason.
Trump isn’t in the Washington primary.
Anything that isn’t fawning worship of Biden for supporting genocide is literally supporting Trump.
